Monsters that need buffs (input needed)

Neo Monsters Neo Monsters General Discussions
1301

I recently got over 50 legendaries. Looking through my list of them I can say that there are 13 I’ve never ever used in a team other than for Whale’s Treasure. Does this mean those 13 are pointless?? No, it just means that there are better options in my other 40 or I don’t have a strong combination of monsters to play with those 13.

There are stronger and weaker legendaries along with a general inflation to their performance in newer ones. Many of the older legendaries which got outclassed or outdated were given buffs so they have some niche use or do something unique but we can’t expect every single one to be viable. Any of the non-limited monsters are basically subject to be outclassed at any point, because the limited monsters are what drives the game forward and brings income for the developers.

So when there’s any reasonable argument for a niche use or unique aspect of a non-limited legendary then I don’t think we can expect them to get a buff. We certainly shouldn’t argue amongst ourselves over it!

Nebel/Cosmo are DR duplicators. That’s strong in itself! They’re not viable in top tier PvP or for experienced players with a large selection of legendaries but they have their unique aspect and are even very effective in a much loved part of the game… UC.

Cryo/Sancta are the only monsters with stun revenge that can duplicate themselves. They have high damage, a swift attack boost and assisted attacks so can do surprisingly reasonable damage despite their obvious lack of strategy. Any clever strategy with good legendaries outclasses them but they’re not completely useless.

Rexo/Kami are another old duo who come up a lot. Now these guys I can actually get behind. They have no unique passives or moves, just a simple “get a kill with quite bad tools” then bloodfury. Bloodfury is exceptionally strong so this is probably why they haven’t got a huge buff, especially because they were the only original non-limited legendaries with bloodfury (ignoring Emeraldeus which is awesome and has been re-branded limited). However, they have nothing unique to offer and there’s no niche place where people would think to use them because a huge number of sweepers simply outclass them. These probably need a buff of some sort.

I hope you can all see where I’m coming from :slight_smile:

1 Like
1302

Well said.

1303

Yeah, just because they can be used with a specific set of other monsters, in a single event, doesn’t mean that they don’t need a buff.

I’ll tell you, I got nebel as my 5th legendary, and even at that point, I have never once used it other than me trying in vain to get something out of that monster that is literally a desert in terms of depth(with 1 cactus that is DR teams, and a water bottle that is already filled by other things(UC)).

Just because it has death revenge and create duplicate doesn’t mean that it’s strong. I don’t know where people get this assumption, but no. It’s not strong. They are not effective in UC, not at all. Everything else is more effective in UC. Emeraldeus, polareon, geartyrant, delugazar, dreamhunt(with patience), the butterfly dragons, soulstealer, now ankou. All of these are simply better in UC, and you have 0 reason to use nebel or cosmo.

I repeat, just because it has create duplicate, and death revenge, doesn’t make it a good monster not needing a buff. At all.

In your argument, you state: “they have nothing unique to offer and there’s no niche place where people would think to use them because a huge number of sweepers simply outclass them.” <- This is nebel and cosmo. You literally can’t say, given everything we said, that this logic isn’t applicable to these monsters.

“They’re not viable […] for experienced players with a large selection of legendaries” <- this is exactly why we want a buff. They are unique. So is dolph, dolph got a massive buff, and is a pretty awesome monster now. Why can’t these guys get the same treatment? Just because something is unique doesn’t mean that it’s not in need of a buff.

Don’t even get me started on cryo/sucktallion. . .

2 Likes
1304

I don’t know where you get that DR + duplicate is strong from.

1305

give rexo double bloodfury, then we will see him more.

1306

Besides dr and duplicate only work on paper in real circumstances people just kill Nebel or Cosmo before they even get a turn they need a massive buff as well as cryo and sanct

1307

@Zardecil You’re way more passionate on this topic than I am, I don’t want to get into an extensive argument. I understand that as an experienced player with lots of legendaries you want them all to be useful in some place or other but that’s not how it’s going to be. Cryo, Sancta, Nebel and Cosmo have their unique place in the game but their strategies are outclassed by other strategies which you can form with your better legendaries. That’s not a fault in the game.

In your post you tried to apply what I said about “nothing unique […] no niche” to Nebel and Cosmo which simply isn’t true so I’m not sure what you’re trying to say with that.

I would argue that Nebel and Cosmo are actually good in UC with the right team. Using Cosmo alongside Aurodragon I’ve formed a UC team that reliably gets into the top 20-30 on the leaderboard… so I don’t see how you can deny they have this use. Sure, you need monsters like Aurodragon or Atrahasis to use them here but you need monsters to support almost all the other UC legendaries like Emeraldeus, Polareon, Geartyrant, etc. (mainly you need a sleep lock).

The Dolph buff was brilliant but unnecessary in my opinion. I think this was probably the Devs deciding they wanted to re-brand it limited and throw some life into it since it was a particularly underused legendary. The limited legendaries are stronger, so it now fits the bill.

1 Like
1308

“I understand that as an experienced player with lots of legendaries you want them all to be useful in some place or other but that’s not how it’s going to be.” Why not? Just because it is one way, doesn’t mean that it will or should always stay that way. That argument is a logical fallacy, and I still don’t know why you keep trying to use it as an argument.

Okay, so they have a single spot where you can use them, in a team with limited legends. First issue, requires limited legends. Sleep lock doesn’t require limited legends. I use gear with stun and a few sleep bombs. Sleep/stun bombs are epics, nebel requires limited legends to be used. This is an issue already. Polareon is the only one that actually requires legend sleepers do to the way he functions(although I could probably come up with a strategy that would make him work without it.)

For rexo? Guess what, I found a niche for him this pvp. He is a dark follow up in 5th slot for my link dark team that punishes chrono monsters. Does this mean he suddenly doesn’t need a buff? No.

1309

There are many different ways I could argue this but the one I’m going to use is the fact the limited legendaries NEED to be stronger than the non-limited (to push sales - I’m sure you get this). At a certain point there will be so many limited legendaries that the non-limited ones are practically useless, because all strategies are exhausted with these limited ones and they do the job better than the non-limited ones. This can be avoided by keeping the non-limited legendaries unique in some way or another, which the Devs do a great job of doing (albeit Rexo/Kami imo). However, sadly this does not mean they’re going to stay viable when compared to the limited legendaries and they may not even have a niche use. We reached this point a few months ago where a number of the non-limited legendaries have very little use for players who have lots of limited, stronger ones.

I think that for any limited legendary we can ask for them to have a place in the game to be strong. Either a certain part of the game or a certain strategy which they have lots to offer.
For non-limited legendaries we can only ask for them to have something unique about them which no other monster has and preferably for that unique thing to be useful in a certain scenario (i.e. in combination with some other things). We can’t ask for them to be as strong as limited legendaries or for them to create a viable strategy which outclasses any strategy offered by a limited legendary.

1 Like
1310

@killerdog are u being salty because you don’t have any of these legends they get a buff they good for everyone( except you maybe) why are you so against their buff if they get op that can easily be nerves something this specific needs a buff

1311

But consider something else. Newbies that have no chance of getting a limited is obviously going to end up with a few non limiteds. What if some poor guy ends up with nebel/cosmo, and their lack of viability makes it unfairly hard for him to proceed? I seriously hate telling people in the team build thread to kick legends out of their team, yet they only have like 2-4 legends total, so I totally understand why they want to use the biggest value stuff. No beginner should have to go through that. Bad luck is harsh enough by not giving people legends in the first place. When they get their first rainbow, it should ideally become a great asset to his/her team. Having monsters like nebel/cosmo and cryo/sanc in the nest is just begging for someone to end up getting the very short end of the stick.

1312

Normally I could agree with that logic. But the issue here is that they are even more useless than your average regular egg monster, to the point where literally no one uses them. There are superepics that are better than him.

I have a friend that picked up neo, and cryo was his first legendary. He came back to me and said “You know? Cryowyrm really sucks, kind of sad that I got him.” No legendary should ever make someone sad about getting that legendary. Normally I could sorta agree with you on that limiteds should be better than others, but when my friend considered quitting because he felt like his legendary was useless, then I can’t agree with you. Cryo is so bad that it almost lost the devs a customer through demoralization.

We aren’t even asking for it to outclass any limited, we are simply asking for it to actually do it’s job effectively, to the point where it might be worth using, not over any limited, but over anything at all. Gear isn’t limited, and it takes over the one niche that nebel has, a strategy in UC.

Then we have stuff like midas, bane, tt, etc. . . all of these are better than nebel by an incredible amount. I am not asking for a buff to levels of something like wraithhost, or azrazel, I’m asking for a buff such that I want to use it at all.

The “non-limiteds have to be useless” logic has too many other flaws, I could write an essay on them, but I got other things to do. But I will say this, if bane, midas, mechaviathan, terrordragon, oakthulhu etc . . . aren’t limited, and they are incredible monsters, then why do we have stuff that is so bad that it can make people quit?

Like I said, nebel was my 5th legendary, it’s so bad that I didn’t use it at the time, and I have only used it trying to get something out of it, nothing worked.

1 Like
1313

Haha! I wrote in that other thread trying to give you some sympathy where others wouldn’t and now you come call me salty. I don’t take that offensively, I just find the irony quite funny :slight_smile:

Of the 6 mentioned legendaries: Rexo, Kami, Cryo, Sancta, Nebel and Cosmo I have all of them except Nebel. Having them buffed would surely benefit me.

@Zardecil Did you friend get Cryo before the update that increased the speed of clones? I think I remember he did. Before that time they were definitely struggling to offer much. Also, I don’t think Cryo/Sancta do as much as you’d like from a legendary if it’s your only one because what you really need early on is some monsters with blood moves.

I think you guys are all way too harsh on these less good legendaries. They’re definitely better than epics and most super epics. The super epics which they’re not better than are the brilliant ones with ridiculously good movesets. Still, it’s better to hear you all complaining about some quite bad legendaries rather than the usual comments on Prisma not one-shotting with dual slayerbane so it sucks and other things which “need more damage”.

1314

He has a low number of legends still, and his cryo still sits on his bench, never used. He has tried, but it doesn’t do anything for him. There are simply better epic options. You want stun? you’re guaranteed to get more out of a 6 cost stun bomber than cryo.

It’s not just that they are less good, it’s that they bring nothing to the table that makes you want to use them.

1315

Shield entrance or roaring entrance(lol)

1316

I honestly can’t differentiate between you Zardceil or the other one lucaryzor I guess so soooo sorry about that but I can’t see your logic on this thread. My bad

1317

can’t see the point of using cryo and sacntallion over the epic clone/stun revenge. The epics cost less and are way faster ( 57 against 84!!!)

1 Like
1318

Also my point so add sped buff to the list as well

1319

The epic stun revenge duplicators do have much higher speed. They’re a bit crazy now that clones have 84% speed too. But they have terrible damage so they are just used for the stun.

Cryo/Sancta on the other hand have assisted moves, 5600 attack and attack boost. They do towards 3000 damage to all enemies in PvP if you’re using an assisted team and have used the attack boost. That’s pretty damn good! I agree they’re bad legendaries but I think their damage gets overlooked way too easily.

When I use my Noxdragon in my link shadow team people always seem to leave it alive and it gets them with the assisted dusk every ~200s dealing ~2000 damage to all their team. I’ve taken down so many people simply because they undervalued my Noxdragon (when my TT comes in and I can get a couple of assisted dusks in rapid succession it’s devastating).

1320

The disrespect! :joy::joy::joy: