I mean general skill
Yeah, but heâs literally got nothing else going for him.
Then donât even make it as a monster. Sleep lock is infamous.
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Anyway I was thinking about Goch againâŚ
Uhm⌠Basically he is the only monster that can regain control VS a poison team.
Not sure what can be done.
Venombreak is not needed as there is only 1 poison monster with HG and they are rarely shielded.
I would say that as x mythic power, Goch is not easy to tone down.
Centaurion, Mojinator, Sepheris exist too.
Chromera, Polaboss, Dracorosa, Glaciaron, Orca, Sherloid, Lilithia (and more) are all scary too. Not to mention teambuilding exists: stun, for example, can be problematic as poison doesnât have the top tier stun immunes other meta strategies have.
If thereâs one thing poison doesnât lack is counters I assure you.
Goch is the only monster that auto-wins though, and thatâs not a good thing.
I meant for the extra damage. Goch is full defense.
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Cos he was designed before mythics were introduced. I donât suppose he needs to be nerfed as well. We need veteran monsters that shine
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Well @DonT89 , as you know,Iâm running a poison fl now. I wanted to know what I could do with it, and to analyze, by running it, if itâs really oppressive or not. I most say its insane 
.
Although, I donât agree with a freezcobra nerf, she is perfectly well the way she is, and helps to the balance of the game (counters OoO) Maybe you should run at least one protection to poison?
But overall, those tree archetypes you mentioned do are too far from balance.
I donât know what the best thing to do about poison would be, I see some other players have suggested a tu restriction, which is pretty reasonable (I know for sure now that Gorgodrake is not the problem @DevilsMisfortune @MementoMori ); but about marks, I would like devs to make âpurifyâ to also eliminate them, as you suggested (which would be better for marks archetype itself, since they could keep releasing monsters of this kind without having the fear of making it more OP)
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He does, trust me.
Goch, at the endgame. Poison is at the front 
What I hate guys is that when I say something you go straight to âoh you should run this and thatâ. This has to stop.
Poison is not a problem for me (except certain settings that include true hit), I am not asking for a counter to be nerfed or else.
I am asking for a meta strategy to be nerfed (as deserved) so people can start thinking instead of just throwing monsters around.
@DevilsMisfortune I correct myself, Goch is the only hard counter to poison rest are just soft counters.
As far as Mark goes, having Purify remove Mark might help, but I think we have better options:
Cynthia could Mark her own allies too, then instead of (Double) Retribution she could get Markâs version of Poisoned Burst. I think that would be more interesting design, and Nefariodon could backfire spectacularly then.
We have very different definitions of soft counter, but whatever, we said what we had to.
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Mark isnât the issue. Trigger is.
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Yeah we donât need hard counters because goch is stupid as hell.
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Racist.
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Lol, whatâs this saltiness against Goch?
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I know, but thatâs only true because Cynthia makes it so easy to Mark opponents.
At this point the devs could decide to keep Mark easy to apply but nerf Trigger as you say, but then Mark would be very similar to Poison. I think it would be more fun to make it harder to control and/or apply, but keeping the super payoff of Trigger.
Thatâs a fair point. Either/or needs to happen
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It was just an observation. If someone running glaciareon in FL, or other kind of good poison counter comes and says âthere is a problem with poison FLs, they are insanely strong and thatâs not good to the gameâ; anyone who would immediately think: âMmm, he is running one of the best counters to poison and even with it he is having serious problems with poison?, maybe he is right and actual poison strategies really are a problemâ. But youâre not even trying to counter it 
, not a single poison killer in the first half of your team. You say âexcept when True hit monstersâ, but is there any actual poison fl without a Titan?. Thatâs what the observation was about.
But that was specifically in your case. I agree with all you said about the problem, there is not doubt about it. As I said, poison FLs are insane, an the other two archetypes too.
I wouldnât like to see a monster get nerfed though. I think itâs better to handle the situation as an archetype, and not a specific monsterâs problem; for instance, purify removing marks and tht TU restriction to toxic entrance as you suggested
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The only âgrey areaâ thing about cobra is the insane damage Detox strike does but thatâs what makes it a perfect poison support. Even with stun absorber, Cobra is rarely a dead weight and I really love the design because of that.
What makes the poison FL so strong is clearly toxic entrance paired with stuff like 90% speed retreat with Blacktitan. Iâm surprised nobody has mentioned it yet? Nevertheless if something needs to be tweaked to get poison FLâs more under control, itâs definitely toxic entrance. This should apply to all forms of it of course.
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Btw, marks disappear when the monster gets hit⌠shouldnât they disappear with poison tick too? Thatâs the monster getting constantly hit for being poisoned and getting nothing good out of it!
Poison should eliminate marks. What do you think of this @DonT89 ?