Really getting tired of the lazy game design

So, I’ve spent the past year or so playing NM, and I have to say that overall I really like it. The missions are fun, lots of events, and the monsters are pretty awesome. All around very creative, and I appreciate that. I’m a level 132 and put some money into a the game during a couple of egg-events.

However, I am really getting tired of the lazy design of fights.

Example: fighting on Floor 10 of the showdown tower against random trainer A. Trainer A has 20 monsters in their team to my 16, okay that’s cool. Then his monsters seem to have about a 25% buff to damage and defense…okaaaay. So having 4 other monsters isn’t enough? Cool, let’s fight anyway… Deep into the fight, he has Flarevrn and Tiamzus come out, I have Tiamzus too, and we both have Deathgazer on deck. I get a kill, then he does but my deathgazer is first. “Poison Massacre” does about 15% damage across the board. Next up, his Deathgazer “Poison Massacre” … team wipe. Dragia comes out and is one-shot my Flarevrn. I get that high-level is supposed to be just that…high level. But buffing things to the point where bloodthirst can’t even kill with one shot is just lazy design. Like seriously? Do your game designers even care about the fights, or are they busy coming up with the next monster that can throw all or spawn in 50 rockoids?

I get that game design on something like this isn’t easy. That requires a lot of delicate time with balancing everything with programming. But it’s incredibly frustrating when you lose fights that have nothing to do with a good team comp, or skill in managing a fight, I *just can’t kill with one hit like you can.* When it takes 5+ poison eater hits before I can even think about killing something, I just stop playing. That’s not fun.

So yeah, I hit Floor 11 in showdown tower and have no desire to continue on. Because some incredibly lazy game designer says “eh, buff monsters by 15% each floor.” You can do better than this, you can do better than that designer. I’m in grad school for game production, I know some great designers who would love to work on a game like this.

Don’t be lazy with your design, please.

Thats the idea of the event - as long as you moving forwards things will be more challenging. That means more monsters on enemy team, and more buff. You can see it in almost every event (if not all of them), nothing new.

As a veteran you should know that poison tickles them on buffed events. No need to use AP or Deathgazer.

The problem is that every event need almost the same strategy - which is sleep lock / SS or whatever. Buffs are not the problem. We need an event that buff poison damage for exemple, so a team like your can be played.

Its a cool idea (as I request it long time ago) but how about events like third fight in DC torch/shortcut? Lots of monsters but no buff?
I think it will be great since we can choose different strategy. Especially since old players or even lucky new member have good poll to create teams, all they need is motivation.
I liked the idea of buffing particular monsters in SOTF, but this DC shown me how awesome things could be if we remove buff and add more monsters.
I suggest a new events called “endless dungeon” and in this event from floor 1-100 enemy team monsters increases from 1-100,so at last battle our 16 monsters against a 100 monsters but no buff.

F2P Arash

So, I’ve spent the past year or so playing NM, and I have to say that overall I really like it. The missions are fun, lots of events, and the monsters are pretty awesome. All around very creative, and I appreciate that. I’m a level 132 and put some money into a the game during a couple of egg-events.

However, I am really getting tired of the lazy design of fights.

Example: fighting on Floor 10 of the showdown tower against random trainer A. Trainer A has 20 monsters in their team to my 16, okay that’s cool. Then his monsters seem to have about a 25% buff to damage and defense…okaaaay. So having 4 other monsters isn’t enough? Cool, let’s fight anyway… Deep into the fight, he has Flarevrn and Tiamzus come out, I have Tiamzus too, and we both have Deathgazer on deck. I get a kill, then he does but my deathgazer is first. “Poison Massacre” does about 15% damage across the board. Next up, his Deathgazer “Poison Massacre” … team wipe. Dragia comes out and is one-shot my Flarevrn. I get that high-level is supposed to be just that…high level. But buffing things to the point where bloodthirst can’t even kill with one shot is just lazy design. Like seriously? Do your game designers even care about the fights, or are they busy coming up with the next monster that can throw all or spawn in 50 rockoids?

I get that game design on something like this isn’t easy. That requires a lot of delicate time with balancing everything with programming. But it’s incredibly frustrating when you lose fights that have nothing to do with a good team comp, or skill in managing a fight, I *just can’t kill with one hit like you can.* When it takes 5+ poison eater hits before I can even think about killing something, I just stop playing. That’s not fun.

So yeah, I hit Floor 11 in showdown tower and have no desire to continue on. Because some incredibly lazy game designer says “eh, buff monsters by 15% each floor.” You can do better than this, you can do better than that designer. I’m in grad school for game production, I know some great designers who would love to work on a game like this.

Don’t be lazy with your design, please.

Let’s see you design a neural network AI and train it with thousands of battles.

let’s be honest, ai is no where near as smart as human players so they need buffs to add challenge and difficulty
however some change would be nice

So, I’ve spent the past year or so playing NM, and I have to say that overall I really like it. The missions are fun, lots of events, and the monsters are pretty awesome. All around very creative, and I appreciate that. I’m a level 132 and put some money into a the game during a couple of egg-events.

However, I am really getting tired of the lazy design of fights.

Example: fighting on Floor 10 of the showdown tower against random trainer A. Trainer A has 20 monsters in their team to my 16, okay that’s cool. Then his monsters seem to have about a 25% buff to damage and defense…okaaaay. So having 4 other monsters isn’t enough? Cool, let’s fight anyway… Deep into the fight, he has Flarevrn and Tiamzus come out, I have Tiamzus too, and we both have Deathgazer on deck. I get a kill, then he does but my deathgazer is first. “Poison Massacre” does about 15% damage across the board. Next up, his Deathgazer “Poison Massacre” … team wipe. Dragia comes out and is one-shot my Flarevrn. I get that high-level is supposed to be just that…high level. But buffing things to the point where bloodthirst can’t even kill with one shot is just lazy design. Like seriously? Do your game designers even care about the fights, or are they busy coming up with the next monster that can throw all or spawn in 50 rockoids?

I get that game design on something like this isn’t easy. That requires a lot of delicate time with balancing everything with programming. But it’s incredibly frustrating when you lose fights that have nothing to do with a good team comp, or skill in managing a fight, I *just can’t kill with one hit like you can.* When it takes 5+ poison eater hits before I can even think about killing something, I just stop playing. That’s not fun.

So yeah, I hit Floor 11 in showdown tower and have no desire to continue on. Because some incredibly lazy game designer says “eh, buff monsters by 15% each floor.” You can do better than this, you can do better than that designer. I’m in grad school for game production, I know some great designers who would love to work on a game like this.

Don’t be lazy with your design, please.

Welcome to the forum, you don’t seem to post a lot.

I’ll give you some advise, don’t waste your time with these posts and spare your fingers. Lol

Most of the people here will throw you under the bus even if you make a lot of sense or be “negative”

Some people here would suck the devs d*cks before assuming any kind of negativity towards the game.

I just logged in for fun today and I saw the same old events from 25 billion years ago, I had to leave work sick.

It’s less about the post and more about the person making the post.

Even you have accused me of being negative from time to time. And I have.

But when every single post from a person is about how something is wrong about about the game and it goes on for months and months, then people are going to notice and ask you why you always attack the devs. Because is less about the post and more about months and months of a person accusing the devs of being incompetent while only looking at their shortcomings.

In fact, I go look at other forums, and I can’t believe how negative they are. I went over to clash royale’s forums and I can’t believe some of the posts there. There is an entire discussion thread asking about what things you hate literally. A negative forum is very counterproductive and doesn’t help the devs as much as a neutral forum. This means having both positive and negative people in it. When I get on someone for being “too negative” it is less about me getting on someone because I like the devs and more about me setting the balance back to the way it needs to be to have a productive forum.

This guy has made a fair point. That just using buffs to increase difficulty isn’t very fun. Last I checked, that’s his first post. And it’s a productive negative post.

I like DC’s torch missions, not buffed but just a huge amount of mons, that is very fun. But of course you need a certain level of buff to the enemy, either through enhancing the stats or increasing the amount of monsters, AI is pretty dumb.

Understand the post, but for more elite players, buffs are really the only way to make the game challenging.  You could have an enemy team of 100 monsters, and while that would be fun, it wouldn’t be particularly hard.  Buffs are what make the game very challenging at the higher levels.

As a point of clarification, I disagree with the OP about bloodthirst on the higher levels of the tower.  My SS and Baz bloodthirst one shot everybody, and even my Shadow’s bloodthirst one shot everyone after only two kills using dreamhunt.  this was all on level 12.  So that part of the post I don’t believe was accurate.

Yeah, the stupid ai has always been a prevalent issue with the game. They did just improve the ai last update, the most prominent difference I’ve seen is that they now know how to use moves non critically to finish off mons on 1hp.

Actually, I think the real major reason why the ai has to rely on buffs is that they’re unable to skip turns. Skipping is an ENORMOUS and fundamental part of pvp battles, and if you were unable to skip then you’d be in serious trouble. Just try a high end pvp battle without ever skipping a turn. Yeah, not as easy as you might think. Of course I imagine it would be quite a challenge to program the ai to able to do it at all, not to mention know how to do it at the right times. If they could though, that would probably almost completely solve them. They’ll still have to get smarter in general of course.

Maybe he has the SE twin death sentence mons, which have a less powerful bloodthirst. Though, I had one in my recent IC team, and it could one-shot up to 300, but maybe tower has higher buffs.

Agree with your post 100% (clarification - I’m not elite - I just have good mons - and play them well enough)

These pics are not to show off! - but to make a point

with this line up - I lost once on the 12th floor vs. The boss battle because of two new legends that caught me off guard , when I foolishly let my bitterbeast get K.O. Ed

Without buffs - these events would be stale/boring- I’d prolly stop playing - buffs /increased mons in enemy line up/team, makes us think to a degree (figure out a functional strategy)and show restraint in order to prevail in the end.

Would love a new type of event which involves actually not buffing or sleep technique.

So, I’ve spent the past year or so playing NM, and I have to say that overall I really like it. The missions are fun, lots of events, and the monsters are pretty awesome. All around very creative, and I appreciate that. I’m a level 132 and put some money into a the game during a couple of egg-events.

However, I am really getting tired of the lazy design of fights.

Example: fighting on Floor 10 of the showdown tower against random trainer A. Trainer A has 20 monsters in their team to my 16, okay that’s cool. Then his monsters seem to have about a 25% buff to damage and defense…okaaaay. So having 4 other monsters isn’t enough? Cool, let’s fight anyway… Deep into the fight, he has Flarevrn and Tiamzus come out, I have Tiamzus too, and we both have Deathgazer on deck. I get a kill, then he does but my deathgazer is first. “Poison Massacre” does about 15% damage across the board. Next up, his Deathgazer “Poison Massacre” … team wipe. Dragia comes out and is one-shot my Flarevrn. I get that high-level is supposed to be just that…high level. But buffing things to the point where bloodthirst can’t even kill with one shot is just lazy design. Like seriously? Do your game designers even care about the fights, or are they busy coming up with the next monster that can throw all or spawn in 50 rockoids?

I get that game design on something like this isn’t easy. That requires a lot of delicate time with balancing everything with programming. But it’s incredibly frustrating when you lose fights that have nothing to do with a good team comp, or skill in managing a fight, I *just can’t kill with one hit like you can.* When it takes 5+ poison eater hits before I can even think about killing something, I just stop playing. That’s not fun.

So yeah, I hit Floor 11 in showdown tower and have no desire to continue on. Because some incredibly lazy game designer says “eh, buff monsters by 15% each floor.” You can do better than this, you can do better than that designer. I’m in grad school for game production, I know some great designers who would love to work on a game like this.

Don’t be lazy with your design, please.

I am sorry that we disappointed you. But players are smart, without buff and extra monsters in enemy team, everyone can clear events without effort.

One of the reasons I love about this game is challenge. I enjoy the moment when I try to make the best team out of my monsters.

Nevertheless, you have a point. That’s why we spent a lot of time improving and testing our AI in last update in order to make the events more challenging without buffing monsters. We will keep improving our event toward this direction.

Thanks for the feedback.

How about a horde event? Like the UC, but instead of buffs, we have to defeat more monsters?

That would be a challenge.

I like that idea too, but unless they put 5 banes in a row, a sleep team could deal with it all (but still fun to try).

So I want to say a couple things. First, thank you for the response, more often than not it feels like these types of things go unanswered. The fact that this got a response from a dev is appreciated.

Second, please don’t misunderstand me, I enjoy this game. The story missions are tons of fun, and I’m excited for chapter 8. The frustration that I have is geared on the fights that are unwinable just do to monsters being so overpowered. I was a harsh in my original post, and I apologize for that. I attacked a person whose job it is to make this game, and the frustration I have as a player is just because I want to see this game bettered as well.

I know that working on and AI system is a large draw on resources. Just an idea that might be a “simple” workaround would be to set a ‘priority of monster’ list for the AI to run through (e.g. If Golrock is on the field, or if a mon has bloodlust up) it becomes the priority target.

I don’t doubt that you folks are working very hard on this game. Again, my apologies for the negetivity. I look forward to seeing this game improve in the months to come.

You are correct, i think I was mixing events or with one of the other blood-something attacks. That is my fault on clarification.

Sometime when you get a chance, check out some of the GDC talks on game AI. There’s a lot of work being in in the field.

Also, if you read my post again, you’ll notice that I was not offering to be a designer, I am a producer. Regardless, you’d still need a programmer to do most of the actual coding. But the framework that he would follow is developed by a designer. (Generally speaking, there are a few Studios out there who handle it differently).