Purpie kinda suck after stun nerf. I am sure its not S+ tier pve anymore.
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Timestrike should get a buff now, reduce the lower cap to around 100tu, and scale from there to make it actually somewhat of a viable move
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Make it a big crit at over 200tu, in my opinion 100tu seems definetely too low
Timestrike =
0.025 (0-59s)
0.03-0.10 (60-79s)
0.1-0.2 (80-99s)
0.2-0.5 (100-149s)
0.50 + 0.005*[s-150] (150s+)
Timestrike scaling is a complicated one. I studied it very carefully and the above is what I found out. Please note this testing was done with Delugazar. Put simply, it scales at a very steady rate from 60s upwards with 100-149s being a little bit faster (+0.3 rather than +0.25).
For reference, a “hit all” attack is roughly 0.16, a chrono killer is 0.7, a weak critical move is usually 0.5-0.65 while a strong critical move is 0.8-1. Monsters with high attack can one-shot with the weaker criticals against non-tanky monsters. The stronger critical moves are one-shots from most monsters.
So timestrike is not really “critical” below 150s but can do some reasonable damage as it approaches that. As it approaches 200s it starts one-shotting, but the monster must be high attack if it’s not a squishy enemy. Beyond 200s (0.75+) is where it becomes very reliable for high attack monsters and if it’s roughly 250s or beyond you can expect a one-shot from almost anything.
Looking at the exact numbers for how the game was originally designed, they make a lot of sense. They’re really nicely balance I think and stun pulse → timestrike often meant the enemy was in the upper range of 150-200s, letting you kill most things but not if the monster is tanky and your monster has low attack.
Where it’s gone wrong is with the introduction of mythics and also HP boost.
Now attacks need to do a lot more damage and it’s so carefully scaled to be perfect for the original numbers. Legendaries not easily one-shotting mythics is kind of fine, but even with full attack stats it’s not a move that can deal with mythics properly so I think that probably needs addressing. Also, it’s probably better to increase the damage rather than increase how much things can stun by, because stun is already controlling enough.
I think the way I’d probably change the scaling is make the 100-149s range go from 0.2-0.7, rather than the current 0.2-0.5. Then above 150s it keeps the same linear scaling of +0.25 every 50s.
This means you still need an enemy over 100s to do any proper damage and it’s from about 125s that the damage gets good, with it being a reasonable critical at 150s. In the 150-200s range it will go from being good to being extremely effective.
As an example, Icefang attacking Sakuralisk at 200s would deal 4730 damage (good but not one-shot). Nightlord attacking Sakuralisk at 200s would deal 5900 damage (one-shot, unless HP boosted).
Two extra notes:
Novadrake has a damage scaling of 1.65x to its timestrike damage.
Timestrike double uses this exact same scaling but it does it for each target then sums the two damage modifiers to get the one it will use for calculating damage. Hence, whether the second target is at 5s or 59s it makes no difference to the total, but it they’re above 60s then they the higher they are the more they will contribute to the damage you deal.
I just made some tweaks to my previous purpie team and its just as good now. (Yes, i used stun lock to setup.) I wouldn’t say it’s not S+ tier, just a little bit different to use.
Oh really? I would love If u share it , are u use duo flower petal ? Because my purpie deck kinda bad now (not fast as before) .
Yeah, as simple as this. Just setup a petal blitz and stun bomb. Should be just enough to setup
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Waiting for 2.41 changes XD
I should get on it this weekend. Too busy during the week.
Anyone who has thoughts about what should change feel free to write them! I’ve had a couple of people give good input already via messages, but I’m interested to see what people think of the stun changes with regards to the tier list.
I feel like arctic should jump up a tier the counter slash buff made him far more reliable in fl
Dont really look like much on paper but having a reliable way to kill of monsters like hu shin cynthia don rilla before they ever have a chance to get going is just note worthy
3 Likes
Luna is F tier lmfao
Honghua Z tier, unicera F tier
I was on the fence about it when writing that last update. I think when the update came out I was intending to move it up a tier but then went back on that decision. Thanks for helping correct that! I’ve adjusted the previous post and it’ll get moved up when I do all the moving later this weekend.
cant wait to see you putting glori all the way down to E or F tier. poor bird didnt deserve any of this
2 Likes
Disgraceonix
True 
I didn’t even get to use it Would have in GoH, but it just one of those that doesn’t drop for me.
Update
Notes:
We recently had an update to version 2.41 which you can see here. This post will cover the movements with regards to these changes.
Stun lock changes
So this was HUGE and a very welcome mechanic change. Now you’ll basically only get benefit from stun if it’s spaced out in your team. Therefore it’s either for: setting up timestrike kills on your monsters, giving yourself breathing room to take control of the battle or breaking the opponent’s momentum. Some moves do not trigger temporary stun immunity, which are basically the ones that were either a very small stun or were for controlling individual monsters on the battlefield. The notable one which still triggers temporary immunity is stun pulse, I guess because it’s on a lot of monsters and has a very favourable TU (50TU for 200s stun).
What this ultimately does is stop people from easily stunlocking opponents by removing their stun protection then chaining multiple stuns in a row. This wasn’t a nice experience, plus meant players felt it was necessary to add excessive layers of stun protection to their team which restricted creativity. Now we should have a healthier experience with stun where protection is necessary but to a lesser extent and stun can perhaps be used a little more freely (without as much setup in advance).
It’s hard to say for certain where things will end up, but for the purpose of the tier list I’m going to move particular monsters that are now significantly stronger/weaker due to this mechanic change and we’ll figure out the rest that need to move over time. What my gut feeling is that stun counters are just as strong, stun bisectors are stronger, stun immunity is weaker and stun absorbers are a bit stronger but I need to be more critical of them. The reasoning for stun bisectors is if you’re only getting hit by one stun then making it smaller is good. There are also more monsters which take 1/2 stun now, which interact very nicely with stun bisectors (or you can stack stun bisectors).
Beetlebrute had survivor bane fixed for use in the FL, making it a stronger monster here but it’s already S in both tier lists.
Prixis had a longer restriction put on moves so it couldn’t skip turn at the start and use them anyway, but I feel like skipping into sonic break is the actual problem and this change doesn’t affect that at all.
Vixenblade not being possible to use behind protectors to easily take out enemies with solo slayerbane removes some of the nastier setups, but it’s still an incredibly powerful monster when you build around it.
Poison siphon got a damage increase, but I’ve already been very favourable to Oakthulhu and Blossomight’s tier positions.
Special rocks got their cost rebalanced, making them far less desirable but they’re still good enough for some teams.
Movements:
The changes below are only with respect to the changes in version 2.41. Firstly I’ll start with the normal changes based on the tweaks, then I’ll go into the stun movements.
Lilithia moves from A → D in general and S+ → S in PvP, with sleep immunity becoming insomnia this is no longer broken, but the addition of stun immunity makes this counter so much stuff and offer a lot to a team.
Soral, god bird moves from S → B in general and S+ → B in PvP, 50->100TU baby conversion completely wrecked this moveset, making Soral no longer able to counter sleep, stun, token disruption nor can it set up defence for itself or charge double bloodfury until it’s been on the battlefield for 180s (that’s when it first attacks). It’s now simply a medium strength sweeper that works nicely in bird union or stealth teams.
Vixian moves from second form tier 1 → tier 2, the buffs here make the summer time → soul missile+ game plan really great, so when it’s set up properly it is a huge threat. However, I’m still keeping it in F tiers because creating a team to utilise Vixian properly is the true challenge.
Arachnodrake moves from C → B in PvP, 50TU stealth is no joke, makes this much harder to disable and the 100-130TU piercing sweeping is strong. I may make this A tier in the near future.
Berry moves from C → B in general, A → S- in PvP and B → A for HP boost, getting yet another situationally critical move is huge, especially because it’s Berry’s first piercing attack. If you didn’t know, her moves are 1.25x the usual damage so she deals better damage than you’d think, especially after the SS. In my opinion, Berry forms the bar for mythic sweepers and that bar has just raised a bit. She’ll likely move back down to A tier in the next 1-2 years as we get more generically good mythic sweepers with things like piercing.
Mechydra moves from F → C in general, E → S- in PvP, second form tier 2 → tier 3 and A → S for HP boost, this has been super charged so if it’s with a robot then it’s a really deadly sweeper that is very tanky and protects your team from sleep and stun pretty effectively. When you have any time to spare, accelerate sting can now ensure you follow up the next hit with another attack shortly afterwards.
F.D. Maeve moves from C → D in general and S → A in PvP, requiring a proper F.D. setup for the SS is how it probably always should have been, so this monster is now balanced rather than easy to build oppressive teams with.
Airavalon moves from F → D in PvP, they’ve done a good job rebuilding this design with recent buffs but, as people pointed out, the time freeze passive really hurts the 200+250TU attacking that it now wants to do in the long-term as it sits on the battlefield. Still, I think there’s enough here to get it out of F tier, especially because it can remove itself if it’s not going to help.
Tridrakhan (s) moves from S- → A in general and S- → A in PvP, requiring link for the SS makes this pretty hard to build around.
Deathgazer moves from D → E in general and S+ → S in PvP, no longer getting a turn quickly heavily diminishes its use for setting up poison in the end-game and it cannot quickly go into backbite to bring in something behind.
Lunactia moves from S+ → S in PvP, with Maeve weakened, stun immunity less necessary in PvP and rockoids dying after 200s this doesn’t stand out like it used to.
Stun movements:
Mythics going up:
Hawknight moves from C → B in general
Haneri moves from B → A in general and B → S- in PvP, now the enemies are guaranteed to be critical hit by either timecrush double or stun immune punisher then solo bloodcrave does 80TU sweeping. I may even put this S tier in PvP, would like to see it in practice first though!
Mythics going down:
Satomi moves from S → S- in general and S → S- in PvP
Huskegon moves from S- → A in general, S- → C in PvP and second form tier 1 → tier 2, this struggles to do anything on the first turn, now that shocking is 160->100s and show of might will likely not stun anything.
Leira moves from B → D in PvP, besides time-passing combos, there are better options.
Aethereon moves from B → C in general and C → D in PvP
Nightingale moves from D → E in PvP
Legendaries going up:
Raizen moves from B → A in general
Pupupa/Stormoth moves from D → C in general
Dolphoenix moves from D → C in general and C → B in PvP
Nulltron moves from A → S- in general and D → S- in PvP
Legendaries going down:
Sanctallion moves from S- → A in general
Cryokaizer moves from B → C in general
Malwing moves from S+ → S in PvP
Sobeking moves from S+ → S in PvP
Pandamonium moves from S- → A in PvP, healing stun is far harder to use effectively, so you rely much more on poison/sleep synergy.
Gloreonix moves from S+ → A in general and A → B in PvP, this was all about stun looping!
Cybereon moves from B → C in general and A → C in PvP
Drakozord Z moves from A → B in general and B → C in PvP, link storm naturally does a lot of stun so they’re going to interrupt one another.
Super epics:
Bitterbeast moves from S+ → S in general
Archseraph moves from A → B in general
Thordragon moves from A → B in general
Twighoul moves from S- → A in PvP
Galvbane moves from S- → S in general and A → S- in PvP
Blitzdragon moves from A → B in general and B → C in PvP
Epics:
Frostbrave moves from S+ → A in general
Ninjastorm moves from S+ → A in general
Sentiguard moves from S+ → A in general
Spiderix moves from S+ → A in general
6 Likes
I’ve finally worked my way through the big stun change update!
Probably next weekend is going to be when I add all the new monsters, as well as make general adjustments. Any input about what to do with all the mythics in S- tier would be great!
1 Like
You are Mean
4 Likes