Yup, exactly
Hmm that’s insane. Why do Def values exist at all then?
I remember having this conversation in the past but I thought it was some weird bug with unevolved monsters. That explains a lot!
Wait the damage gets reduced because they are an SE?
Forgive my ignorance, I’ve been in the game for a long time but not much time on the forum.
How is it possible that 4.5k defense in an SE is the same as 7k defense in a mythical?
If this is the case, I think it would be better to give a percentage value as is done with speed, I don’t see the point in giving a numerical value, this only causes confusion. Please let me know if I misunderstood. Greetings
They need some way to indicate how high the defence is and presumably stats like shown in the game is what resonates with most people. I agree though that it’s very unintuitive once you start thinking about it.
Defence is incredibly complicated. There are many aspects to it. Put simply (still missing out some bits):
- Monsters can only have 5 different levels of defence at base (what we call “full attack” … “full defence”).
- If defence is buffed/nerfed by various effects the “defence factor” part of damage calculation is capped at 0.5 and 2 (lower and upper).
- Lower form monsters have additional multipliers involved which essentially boost their defence.
- For some of the defence buffs we see in the game they put an additional layer to the damage calculation (e.g. perfect stance = 80% damage reduction, vigorous = 60%, bind+ = 50%).
You’re correct the “bug” with lower forms was discussed in the past when I discovered it by reverse engineering all this to do with damage calculation and spotting what appears to be a mathematical error.
I intended to elaborate on all of this extensively in a move damage guide but I never ended up getting to write that. I hope to someday.
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The problem will keep going back to cost. What’s the point of team cost if there are plenty of absurdities?
Now the SE boost will create even more. Maple at a cost 10 tanking heavy hits is way too OP. It needs a cost increase as well as every boosted monster should.
Bridalith 2nd form has shield all entrance, pushes back next enemy monster to have a turn, can be removed to repeat and has a shieldbreak move at a cost of 11, come on. The cost system seriously needs to be revised. The whole fixed cost for mythics/legendaries/SE doesn’t work anymore and will make even less sense now.
I feel maybe the devs might be spending too much time designing waifus and not enough playing their own game.
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Never paid that much attention to the damage numbers as it doesn’t matter as much in PvE. Nice to learn this after all this time, it’s kind of mind blowing and unbelievable that it isn’t explained at all in game, and left for players to discover 
And I agree now about maple, it will definitely be more useful than some mythics with the HP boost.
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Something I realised is that it has lower defence than the standard Rockoid. So I’m not sure if extra HP will help much. However, there are a few like Meatoid, Rockoid and LeBroid with high defence where I think it might matter. A critical move will still easily take them out so it’s hard to know how relevant that is but maybe it’ll be great.
The trade-off between putting the boost elsewhere is a big one, so I don’t think they’re a high priority target but in the long run it may be useful to have a couple of very low cost monsters that actually take a significant hit to take out. Diamonoid is 4 cost, so it’s a bit much for something unreliable. Rockoid being just 1 cost is probably a lot better.
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@Dev_VKC A damaged, 80% health Mapledragon (boosted) just tanked a defang from Y Ddraig Goch, which even has elemental damage. That seems a bit ridiculous 
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Bring back old hp boost mechanics we didnt knew what we had !
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I’m not here to disagree with you but doesn’t Y draig goch have horrible attack stats which is why he has that horrible secret skill?
It’s level 39 Attack 4545.
Also elemental advantage and it’s 2 categories higher.
Maple should be dying there every time.
I think the HP boost is too much for SEs.
Mabledragon has 4500 defense and with hp boost it has 5262 health. Unless you targeted two poison units or used his passive: no, he should not die there. If you are asking for his defense nerf, defang/toxic killer multiplier buff, or HP boost nerf… this post is pointless lol
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HP boost was a really BAD idea since the beginning
Nuff said
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Completely agree
I’m saying, as per the context of the thread, and the last line of my message, that the HP boost shouldn’t boost SEs that much. Not to the point where an SE is surviving a move like that with elemental disadvantage.
It was on 80% health when it was hit by defang too due to the passive of the VD before.
If you think it’s pointless, feel free to ignore.
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You want HP boost for SEs to be nerfed but the real problem is mapledragon.
You also think an old gen mythic has more priority over a new gen SE in the devs mind. It’s just not how they work. (ignore this sorry)
At no point have I said that.
I’m out.
Congrats, you just arrived to the point that I was making, that now we have HP boost that does nothing to myths in terms of survivabilaty, but now we got some hybrid 10 cost “Super Epic mythics” that can survive the actual mythic sweepers.
I played maybe 15 matches since the update and I’ve counted 6 boosted Mapledragons on teams.
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