Nice try to make yourself look like an underdog against the big baddies, but I’ve been trying to get Prixis’ design changed since her release so she doesn’t do the problematic stuff in the FL and earlier in this same discussion said that she should be nerfed. What I’ve always said is her issue is a separate issue to Chary, Chary simply showcases where Prixis turns into a problem when under normal circumstances Prixis is just a strong monster.
Put it this way… if Prixis got nerfed and Charybdia was left untouched (along with no extra counters released) then we’d still see Chary everywhere in PvP. Many people are playing it without Prixis in their team and doing very well. Speaking from my own experience, I enjoyed over 90%+ win rate last season with my Chary FL and I don’t own Prixis. That was in a meta where I met lots of Chary counters and the Prixis FLs took out my Chary no problem
So that’s why we absolutely have to talk about Charybdia. She’s warping the meta regardless of any other monsters owned, especially because lots of people obtained her in the anniversary.
I agree. Bind+ is such a cool design and it’s a great special move for her
Exactly. Speed nerf will make her worthless and useless. So main problem is twin kb then should restrict that. If problem is in branch you should cut branch not whole tree.
Charypdia’s root problem is that she can make any action unconditionally at the speed of 75 and gain an advantage that can affect the outcome of a battle, so speed is her root problem.Her every move is very scary as long as she can act. No myth has such a strong sense of oppression.
except the only reason we are discussing it is because of popular use. its not that surprising that it would be after anniversary. and the fact that many people have actually said it …
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so should we have nerfed everything which has been coming up on restrict list for past 6-8 months?
the context here is very important. now it’s been established that charybdis has numerous counters compared to aforementioned mons. Mai, prixis, unicera, megalo, glaciorn, joco etc. the problem here is that she facilitates whichever team has control, its why prixis line with her are so popular and oppresive not the other way round.
heck her use also reduced another popular mythic’s usage (sakuralisk).
now I am not saying that nerf maynt be needed, but if it is to curb useage because of popularity than i think there is an issue especially when there are some very valid counters present in the game. I would rather suggest waiting for some time before making that actual change.
I think there clearly is a problem with the power level of Charybdia. It’s just that she does so many things with too high speed. If you knew anything about the history of the game, people will complain if a new monster doesn’t look like a top PvP monster and stay pretty silent while spending gems when the monster is very strong. Of course now we had a lot of discussion revolving around the appearance of Charybdia which overshadowed it a little, but it was immediately clear that she will be very strong and those monsters are the most susceptible to later changes. Then when a couple of months go by, it’s gonna be in many teams and people will start raising the issue.
I personally think her speed will be reduced and probably a new useful gravity field monster will be released in the near future.
I remember when Scorpiogeist was released and it was one of the most broken things out there. It could wipe out teams on its own. I was lucky enough to hatch it pretty early on and I legitimately destroyed people in PvP with it. Pretty much its only counters were Searguard and Centaureon. It was inevitable that it would be nerfed but of course I was upset because for once I had access to a powerful S+ monster. But the nerf really was for the greater good.
Sooo should we nerf every strong mythic ? As you and anrag and cesar argue? While me and kd and others are more focused on the mechanics of the mythic and his speed and his moves ,you arguing back by mentioning other strong mythics like carmilla and vixenblade and aaying they are strong and should be nerfed while you donr give any valable reason except they are strong , soo should we nerf every strong mythic ?? And make them equal ?? No tanky one ? If we do this its the end of the game
I think the goal would be to avoid a situation where monster x in slot y is objectively better than any other monster in that slot. Or that a specific frontline or endgame is in most situations better than any other frontline or endgame.
Because that’s when everyone will start playing the same monsters as they’re just so much more effective than all the other possible combinations.
Isn’t that pretty much what happens with Prixis and it’s been happening for a while. Knockback/Repulse frontline is not a new thing and it’s been the meta for a while with Capybara, Dragulus, Cynthia, Sakura and so on… Ganging up on Chary for it because it’s widely available without even trying to offer some counter options before doing so and right after an anniversary egg is very fishy to say the least.
I completely agree with the goal you mentioned, but all the cries to change certain things made by ‘weaker’ players were ignored and when the meta becomes a bit more available to everyone (including all the top players) there’s a massive hurry to change it. That’s my beef and that’s what I’m trying to point out so we don’t rush into making a mistake nerfing a single monster that won’t change the current meta in the slightest.
It’s annoying seeing Chary in every team, yes, let’s offer more counters to it, buff some older monsters to take her out and move on with it, but let’s address the current meta fl altogether, not a single monster.
I agree she does lot of things, but there is always a specific caveat associated with them.
specifically, her bind makes the overall game 3v3 for roughly 250~300tu and 4v3 for 80-100 tu.
During this time she gains def boost.
However i think this is a very significant improvement where in a monster can have stat boosts with caveat which is a very welcomed change compared to what we have seen in the past. (vespiaquen,maeve, carmilla, vixenblade etc). Rather than making it broken, we do have ample opportunity to get rid of the Charbydis(she is inert for 300tu).
Or take her other move raw-twin knockbacks. This also kinda ensures that we aren’t running AP driven setups which has been the case in past for many of those def boosted/stat boosted monsters. This also allows one to comeback in the game in case you are losing, which is quite frankly a really welcomed stuff. It’s been really lacking in mythics that have been released off late and are all about maintaining the advantage.(which is why i gave those specific example)
Her other two moves venom-time’s up and Virulent grasp are really situation based. They have also have a restriction in case of Vriulent grasp(250~300tu), which makes any ill-thought nerf really damaging to her moveset and percieved value.
There is also very significant difference here, we aren’t going to see any increase in charybdis since already huge number of people have her courtesy of anniversary. Nerfing a monster when in fact its not been a month when it does have significant number of counters available in the game seems wrong imo.
Also I have completely different take on this monster. Imo its been one of the most well designed and possibly the amongst more balanced side strong mythic they have released of late. I would rather welcome the change she is bringing where in moves can provide such diverse utility rather than just spamming mythics which is fast and bulky. I would rather welcome more monster like her which have this kind of flexibility rather than bringing more of those *boosted fast mons or getting her nerfed. And I think this is again start of new meta which we should get accustomed to.
As for nerfs, I have not quite frankly felt they were well deserved for most of the past mythics/legendaries. I mean just think about it what kind of diversity we could have now that you know the current stuff and previous stuff. Lot of them maeve, cynthia etc could have been viable in the current times as well had they not been nerf. Would have made the play lot more dynamic rather than switch we are having of few teams.(Not saying some of them didn’t need the nerf, but just think abt nerfs that happend to nauticruiser, plumelisk’s baby forms etc, it is what lead to stun nerf and the viscious cycle would never stop unless we understand what’s debilitating to the game and not do it on just popular choice).
I can’t say for others, but i def have an issue with what’s been proposed. I have been very pragmatic about it, nerfs shouldn’t happen unless its really needed and we have really seen it for a while.
That’s not the case with charybdis, not only is she “counterable” compared to other alternatives that were mentioned and also we haven’t had enough time to actually gauge “what needs to be nerfed” exactly. And amongst all those monsters that have been mentioned she is the only one which doesn’t start of “bulky” and is in fact inert for 300 tu roughly. Plenty of time to kill her compared to others that have been mentioned.
That’s not the case with the two examples i mentioned, If a monster is oppressive and really doesn’t have many counters at all in the game imo it should at least be looked at. And i have felt that especially when seeing those 2 monster’s second form working so well.
I think her speed is reduced to a reasonable level, you can refer to Maeve. In addition, her binding skills are shortened to 250second, which is more reasonable. Other don’t have to make any changes, she is still strong.
name one that isnt an awakened mythic and not glaci. i will wait
talking big when iterally the entire top 3 people been spamming her. Char bind can make something remain a deadweight from the start and she can obliterate a fl with her alone with how fast she is + raw double knockback. Prixie snips something. there is a clear difference here. Prixie players before knew to pair her with other fast knock/sweepers that can get them control as much as possible.
no, she is important. She gives advantage but not one where it will decide the match from the rip off. and this is not a situation of poor against rich or something. we have shrine and that is literally the way to awaken stuff now. i know f2ps who has many awakens because they have been patient with what they spend and they grind always
well it wasn’t enough in maeve case,
she needed 3-4 separate nerfs to reach to a point where she is no longer anywhere. If that’s your intention, you are in the wrong place.
And no i don’t think i agree with speed restriction either by reducing it by 10 tu. I think she is just right, just think for instance if you would like to run something like prixis with like 15-20 tu lower speed).
The speed is actually needed in her case for her to get to pull of one of the moves. As its already been established killing her isn’t actually the main issue, you can use specific mons and no they don’t need to be “awakened” stuff.
Perhaps a specific storm mons with sonic break could be released for ex with poison immunity, it could kill her if that said mons had defang. Or an Earth mons with gravity field of similar sort, high speed.
Or we could have super epics with high speed and attacks of all 6 elements which could counter popular high speed mythics. After all Hp Boost is anyways rigged towards Legends and SE. Like we had with Worms.
1- pure RNG.
2- I also remember that I didn’t last long not because you beat Charybdia lol, but you beat my best monsters namely, orca, c
angelion, novadrake, sacrumega, Glaciaron, the others are just filler for lack of good things. So it’s absurd to say that my team is only dependent on Charybdia based just on a fight in such a rare situation where your orca went first. You are totally wrong on this part. I myself removed this girl from my team to put Orca back next to my new sturge that I got not long ago.
And GG
I’m all for buffing a few other monsters to counter her, no problem with that, just no need for such a quick nerf.
What is you biggest concern with it? Raw twin knockback? Use Joco or some other gravity monster. Padrinorca can sometimes outspeed her but unfortunately it’s on the restriction list. People have also been talking about adding more counters to it, so nobody is saying that the situation doesn’t need some form of addressing, but simply nerfing it seems a bit rushed as it’s her first restricted pvp season. I think overall 99% of the players won’t mind offering more counter possibilities, it’s the nerf that’s the issue.
The top 3 are most likely spamming Prixis as well and have been for months, so there’s that. What’s your point? Do you agree that both monsters need to be addressed?
If you take the out a key monster and then open way to knockback the rest, then it is a massive advantage, which is exactly how Prixis is played. Then good luck getting back in the game when you have a wall of Mythics to deal with.
The thing is that 2/3 of them dedicated their entire frontline to making sure that chlamydia gets a turn and most of the time it worked perfectly. Their entire early game hinged on that happening and they didn’t get punished for that because it’s just so strong. Mine did to a lesser degree because I could sweep with onyxia and gorgo even if it didn’t work, but there’s no way I’d be able to run a frontline like that without chlamydia.
You guys keep mentioning all the counters to chlamydia that are around, but you’re missing the point. A bunch of those counters wouldn’t be around or at least would be way less common if chlamydia didn’t exist. It’s warping the meta so much that every viable frontline needs to have at least a soft counter or else they’re screwed.
This is probably the most brain-dead conversation existed from a split anime girl vagina having Bind+ followed with half boobs opened using Fermata.
Can we all just settle down a little? I’m afraid that the devs will get confused as to either nerfed Char or not.
Let’s just calm down a little and maybe make a poll instead to see if the majority wants to nerf her or not, that way… this long-lasting brain rot debate will never be finished and people will start to forgetting the purpose of the conversation and instead harassing others.
Devs might be currently listening to both sides whether to nerf it or not, and it’s getting confusing.
How about we just settle down and make a poll about it? That way, we can see whether the majority really wants it to be nerfed for good and let the devs choose the conclusions of the end of the result.
This is no by mean to harass others or trying to offend others, but to offer a more clear solution for this endless debate.
